Question about "debriefing"

[~Kaz~]

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this so mods please move if it's not but I figure the women coming into this section can probably answer my question.

I had a rough time when DS was born. I've "debriefed" it by 'telling my story' to two MCHNs (seperately) and a counsellor. I haven't found 'telling' it to have helped very much at all and the counsellor I spoke to found some of my story funny (stuff that happened to me after the c/s which btw I didn't find funny at all) and she got the giggles so I won't be going back there. I still get very upset when I think or talk about my experience and I feel haunted that my c/s was unnecessary so I'm spending a lot of mental time blaming myself for making poor decisions or failing to do things I thought I would do like question the doctor, ask for time to think etc. Friends and family either don't talk about it, don't understand how I feel or think that I'm 'over it' by now.

My question is, how do I determine if my c/s was medically necessary for DS's safety or whether I was rushed into it? I am thinking about getting a copy of my hospital notes and records but who do I take them to in order to get an independent opinion? Can I hire a midwife or would I be better to see another ob? I'm in a small country town and I am prepared to travel but I worry that anyone in the medical system will simply support the decisions that were made in my case because of concern over litigation. I'm not looking to sue anyone and probably don't have grounds anyway I just want the truth. As much as I will be shattered if I learn that I should have waited longer I need to know. How do I find a truly independent opinion?

TIA.

[Townsvillegirl]

Kaz - What an awful thing for the counsellor to do. She doesn't sound very professional or qualified. I think I would be putting in a complaint to someone about her.

I think getting a copy of your notes would be a great place to start even for you to have a read through them and get a clear picture in your mind of what happened. I don't know much about birth debriefing but I would think having a look at your notes would help (though be warned, my notes didn't record things accurately and left me feeling more frustrated because I know they were wrong).

I'm sorry that you didn't get the birth that you wanted and it was an awful experience. Good on you for trying to work through it. I hope that you get some peace about it all eventually and that you can find someone to help you process it all.

[Trillian]

If I had people get the giggles when I was pouring my heart out about something that has deeply affected you, then I would feel like it didn't help much at all. Talking about it will help - when you talk to the right people who will take every word you say seriously. I honestly don't know who would be best for an independent opinion but I would be erring towards a midwife as an Ob is only going to be able to see that everything was medically 'justified' kwim?

[blessedatlast]

What an awful experience.. I am not sure on this but I think when you request to see your notes a doctor sits down and goes through it all with you so you don't get confused and misinterperet the medical terminology.. If this is the case maybe a social worker at the hospital can be there?? Don't they have trauma counsellors at your hospital? I hope you get what you need.. Also FWIW I would put in a complaint about this counsellor.. How unprofessional and horrible..

[shellbell3]

Kaz- Have you thought of going to see a new councillor?
As for the records I think it may be tricky to get an exact answer, different people even in that area still may have varied degrees of opinions. And I have to ask if you honestly think it will help? If you get given the answer that you don't want to hear from one person it'll play even more on your mind the whole 'should I have done this... said this....' And then another person could turn around and say the exact opposite.
If you think reading thru eveything will make you feel more at peace with what happened by all means you should do so and try find midwife to help explain terms that you don't understand.
Remember regardless you cannot change the outcome so going over and over in your head and trying to analyse everything may not help. I think maybe seeing a councillor and talking about what feelings you are experiencing now would help, you need to try to find some way to accept what has occured so you can find peace in this traumatic situation.

[Midwife Melissa]

Originally Posted by ~Kaz~

My question is, how do I determine if my c/s was medically necessary for DS's safety or whether I was rushed into it? I am thinking about getting a copy of my hospital notes and records but who do I take them to in order to get an independent opinion? Can I hire a midwife or would I be better to see another ob?

Hire a midwife and get an independent opinion from him/her. Living in a small country town is not an issue: you can scan and email your records to the midwife or photocopy and post them. The midwife can do the debriefing over the phone.

[~Kaz~]

Thanks for your responses girls.

I did think of going to another counsellor - I was kind of making light of the issue the counsellor laughed at (I rolled my eyes), at the time but it was more due to embarrassment than true humour. She might have misinterpreted me but I still didn't feel comfy to go back. She kept telling me how articulate I was in re-telling my experience, insightful etc etc and her main recommendation was to give it time and to stop putting so much energy into it. I have given it more time and have actively stopped myself thinking about it for a while now but I don't feel any better. I know exactly why DS's birth upsets me so much - so far that knowledge hasn't helped me to feel any better (insight doesn't always lead to change and all that), which is why I'm thinking that focusing on the medical stuff (rather than my emotional experience of the events) could work better for me.

Shell - I have thought about the questions you posted. I know there may not be one single answer to whether my c/s was needed. (Emotionally I know this is what I'm looking for - someone to say, yes you did the right thing or no, you should have done a, b,c, etc and I know that having a 'correct' answer might not be realistic). At this point, I am blaming myself anyway for not being able to birth him vaginally so I figure that perhaps if it really was necessary, then having that information might help me to forgive myself and move on. I also have heaps of questions related to medical things that went on just before and after his birth. I was told afterwards that I was "always high risk" for a c/s, but the NUM who told me that was quite full on in her personality and approach to me, quite strange at times, she was convinced I was going to get PND and I now suspect she was only trying to make me feel better about the outcome. She said they (the staff) didn't want to say anything to me beforehand because they didn't want to freak me out (I went in for CTG monitoring for 2 days before I went into labour). Ok. I can kind of accept that I might have been high risk but then I wonder about whether the staff just pegged me as a likely c/s so didn't give me as much of a chance to labour on my own (as they would have if they hadn't already formed that preconception). Does that make sense? There are other questions I have too.

Midwife Melissa - This is embarrassing that I don't know but, how do I go about hiring a midwife?

Thanks again for your posts. It has kind of helped me to nut out why I want my records and what I'm hoping to achieve by getting them.

[AliB]

Dear Kaz

I'm so sorry to hear of your struggles to come to terms with things. My darling sister has been dealing PND and one the main warning signs that led to the diagnosis was her increasing thoughts about her disappointing birth experience. She's now seeing a counsellor and feeling a lot better about things.

You must be a wonderful story teller if you had the counsellor so engrossed that she got the giggles! Just searching through the forums, I don't think you've posted your birth story on BB yet? If not it might do you good to share it in writing, just as you found it beneficial to tell it to the nurses, and I'm sure there'll be loads of support forthcoming as always.

I noticed this thread today: National Caesarean Awareness Day

Take care xo

[~Kaz~]

Thanks Ali. I've just posted in that other thread actually!! I haven't posted the birth story up here yet. Not sure why. Don't feel ready to I guess. Talking about it in the early days with family and then later with MCHN's and the counsellor didn't seem to help so I'm reluctant to put myself out there again I guess. I still get teary if I think about it for too long but I don't think I have PND as I'm ok otherwise. Sending a big to your sister. I'm glad she found counselling helpful.

I just called about getting my medical records. The bloke that does the FOI's only works mondays so he's going to call me back next week.

[shellbell3]

Kaz, I hope you can find closure on this and stop blaming yourself. Reading the records may be helpful to explain to you why you needed the c-section. And remember they were the health professionals and you were following what they believed was the right thing to do to avoid any distress to J. You can't blame yourself for that.
Maybe try find a councillor who deals with this sort of area?

[Midwife Melissa]

Originally Posted by ~Kaz~

Midwife Melissa - This is embarrassing that I don't know but, how do I go about hiring a midwife?

Which State are you in and I can point you in the right direction?

[~Kaz~]

Thanks Shell. I know I need to get past this before we even think of TTC No. 2.

Midwife Melissa - I'm in NSW. I sent a general e-mail to ASIM this afternoon inquiring about whether their members would provide this type of service but any other ideas would be greatly appreciated. I know I can go back to the Dr and/or NUM involved in my care but I don't quite trust them (which may well be my issue more than theirs but the NUM got under my skin with being patronising at times and the doc has a knack for saying very little and being very laid back about everything).